Advice on rockback and moving up a pole.

[lifecaster9]

Forget about form he needs a proper pole. He weighs 165 and is using poles rated at 155. Did everyone miss that?

[KirkB]

Forget about form he needs a proper pole. He weighs 165 and is using poles rated at 155. Did everyone miss that?

If you're referring to an implied need for a quick fix for his upcoming HS meets in the next month, then yes, I ignored that.

My advice (as always) is longer term technique and training advice. I personally have no pity on anyone that posts on PVP a week before a big meet and desperately asks for a quick fix. In my opinion, there's no such thing - altho I guess there's no harm in asking.

It's like cramming for an exam, after not doing regular homework all year. Not the best way to learn.

In this thread, Gabe did NOT ask for any quick fix, altho it would be understandable that he wants to improve his PR during the school year. Instead, he asked about his rockback (technique), and about moving up a pole. I was only answering the first of his 2 questions (technique).

He needs a heavier pole to be legal for this year's high school competitions, but he's actually not blowing thru yet in training with the light pole. But once he improves his technique (as recommended), I agree that he will need to move up poles. For HS meets this year, he will have to beg, borrow, or steal a pole that's legal for his weight and hope for the best. I offer no other advice on that particular question.

Lifecaster, if you have any pole advice for Gabe, please give it to him.

I think it's important not to confuse proper technique issues with legal HS pole weight issues.

Kirk

[GabeA]

I have some insight from watching film and actually vaulting, as to why my step is under. Other than that stutter in the first video (which I don't normally do), I have noticed myself over striding on the last step or two. I don't mean to argue, but instead of moving my step back, shouldn't I keep the same run, but fix the mechanics instead?

[Rhino]

If you are overstriding, it is because you feel like you are out. If you feel like you are out, you likely are out. So you end up being under. Having someone catch your takeoff point will cause you to start farther back and then overstride and be still farther under. Use a midmark instead.

[caroline93]

As far as working on the block in your bottom arm -

I have had trouble with this concept from the other end, my arm often collapses in. With all of the debates as to what exactly goes on with the bottom arm post-take off, I think it has been established that if you are following the Petrov model there should be more than zero resistance by that bottom arm (correct me if I am wrong?)

As a fellow vaulter, I can tell you how I have worked on fixing this. I heard a coach tell their athlete once to remember to "punch" at the take off. All technical arguments aside, I've found this is a helpful way to think. You don't want a collapsed arm all the way through, but you don't want a locked out elbow either. When you take off, if you think about punching up with that bottom arm and then releasing, this can help you accomplish the happy medium.

Quick disclaimer - I am not arguing that a "punch" is the physical motion exactly that should be enacted by the bottom arm, simply that it has been a cue that helped me!

[KirkB]

As far as working on the block in your bottom arm -

I have had trouble with this concept from the other end, my arm often collapses in. With all of the debates as to what exactly goes on with the bottom arm post-take off, I think it has been established that if you are following the Petrov model there should be more than zero resistance by that bottom arm (correct me if I am wrong?)

The Petrov Model way is to bend the pole with the force of the run through the top hand - not through the bottom hand. Here's what Bubka said about this (I enlarged the font on the important phrases):

Q. How would you describe the action of bending the pole?
A. Before the fiber glass pole, pole vaulters put their focus on moving the pole, then, when the flexible pole appeared many people put their focus on bending the pole. The pole bends as a result of the speed and mass of the jumper, therefore, it is more important to concentrate more on moving the pole towards the plane of the bar, rather than being aware of bending it. If the vaulter can put all his speed to the pole, the bending of the pole will happen in a very natural way and this, together with a good height of grip will ensure good results.

There's some PM coaches that do recommend a slight push with the bottom arm. I don't. The reason is that (1) it's really not necessary; and (2) young vaulters will inevitably interpret a slight push as being a big push (or too long of a push), and focus far too much on that part of their vault.

I think this is because they (or their coaches) don't understand the physics of what makes the pole bend.

The pole will bend on its own, so that's not something that you need to focus on. Instead, focus on improving your run, plant, takeoff, and stretch, and you'll find that the bend will happen IN A VERY NATURAL WAY - just as Bubka explained.

In particular, pay attention to your POSTURE on takeoff. It's your POSTURE (slight fowards lean, fully stretched arms) that will pass most of your energy (from your runup) into your pole; help your pole bend; and prevent you from getting fiber-faced.

Another way to say this is that a push (slight punch or big push or anywhere in-between) will not fix your technique, if you have bad POSTURE on takeoff. Focus on what matters - fix your POSTURE!

Kirk