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To someone to make it seem nearly impossible. A lot of kids want to try it so they won't have to run, and I want to see which ones are actually for sure, and which ones are lazy. I'm a big time workout warrior, so I think I could weed most out by myself with my workouts. I want to intimidate the lazy ones with describing how hard it is...
Any ideas?

I forgot to add, my workouts consist of...
A sprinting workout, usually ladders, from 50 to 300 meters and back, done at increasing intensity, until about 90 percent and then back down to 60.
A lifting regime, which consists of lower and upper body lifting, as well as olympic lifts.
Jumping workout, which consists of plyos for over 100 meters, and then plyo boxes and bleachers.
Swimming - As fast as possible, for better body control and awareness.
Abs- Ab workouts, usually around 1000 a set, and depending on the day, can go up to 5000.
All this, and we havent even started vaulting yet.

I do this for about a week or so to get myself back to shape, and then start vaulting.

Split wrote:Ab workouts, usually around 1000 a set, and depending on the day, can go up to 5000.
All this, and we havent even started vaulting yet.

Split, if your reps are true, I'm impressed. In my day, I only worked myself up to a few 100 situp reps per day - max (I don't remember the exact number)! They weren't my actual workout. They were more of a "cool-down", once I was so tuckered out from the rest of my workout that my legs and arms were dead tired - so I worked on the last part of my body that was still "alive".

I do, however, challenge both the accuracy of your counting, and the wisdom of doing so many reps per day. If it's not situps, then reps of what? The reason I ask is because you need to divide your workout time into areas of strength, speed, coordination (gymnastics), conditioning, and endurance. I used situps as a strength, conditioning, and an endurance drill (by doing them last, before I hit the showers). It sounds like you might be using them for a major part of your workout, which takes time and energy away from all of the other areas that vaulters also need to work on. How many miles per week are you running whilst you're doing all these ab reps?

Regarding your thread title, I'm a little puzzled. Are you truly wanting to ENCOURAGE "ambitious" beginners whilst DISCOURAGING lazy people? If so, then there's no need to scare them away with words. Words are just words. Lazy athletes will weed themselves out by Darwin's theory of natural selection - Survival of the Fittest!

I hope you're not a coach - you have a very immature attitude. I mean that in an honest, constructive way, so take it to heart. Rather than boasting about your hard workouts, why don't you encourage as many kids as you possibly can to join the sport? Don't tell them how tough it is - tell them how much fun it is! You might find a few "diamonds in the rough". You might even find some kids that are initially lazy, but come to love the sport, and get over their laziness.

I've heard of baseball teams and soccer teams having to make early cuts, due to too many players. But I've never heard of a new vaulter getting cut from workouts. You can't really tell from the first practice who will stick with it and who won't. The more the merrier. Kids will weed themselves out - you don't have to.

I see no need to "intimidate the lazy ones with describing how hard it is".

Oh yes - I almost forgot ...

So you did this "heavy workout" for only ONE WEEK, and then you were ready to vault? Exactly what week of this year was this week? I wonder what you did the WEEK BEFORE that week? If I did HALF those workouts for only ONE WEEK, I'd be so dog-tired and aching that I'd barely be able to pull the pole out of the bag! There's a lot of bravado in your claims, but I would be interested to hear what your workouts REALLY consisted of - and for how long before you picked up a pole - THIS YEAR!

Kirk

The issue of how to cut kids has been dealt with in the 'Coaches' forum, but I will add my opinion.

There are those that only want to pole vault so that they do not have to run. I would not do such distances as 300 meters. That is not a vaulting distance. The most a vaulter should run (other than for off season cross-training and warm ups) is 200 meters, and it is a waste of time to do more than 5 or 6 a month. End your workout session every once in a while with a 200 or 2. This is only to help build some competition endurance, NOT necessarily for speed. The 50 should be the one where you really work at. That is even pushing it, how many vaulters do you know with a 50 meter run up?

Get these 'non runners' to run a little bit, sure. They'll quit soon enough if you only do track work for a week, to include hundreds of pole runs, flying 20's, 30's, 6 step drills, ins and outs, and some 50's. No ladders. Those are totally inappropriate for a vaulter during the season. Show them that they will not have an easier practice then the 400 runners, their practice will be tougher... if they're willing to give it everything they've got. I'm a proponent of a 'hellweek' type scenario, (of course not as bad as BUD/s or anything like that, that would be ridiculous) but you have to encourage the ones that you know that actually want to do it. Tell them they can do the sit ups, they don't have many more seconds to go for the leg lifts, they're almost done with push ups, etc. And make sure to do everything yourself first, to show them that it's possible. (And I am also curious as to how you are doing 5000 sit ups in a session... how long does that take you? Are these real sit ups, or just crunches? Do you keep your back straight, or do you 'roll', like 99% of the sit up community?)

Get a pole in everyone's hands on day two or three and have them do some planting and some sand vaulting. This will give you a good idea about who's coordinated and more importantly, who's coachable.

If you really want to describe the vault, you need to buy BTB2, like I've suggested to you a few times already, (ESPECIALLY if you're going to be in a student-coaching role very much like I will be,) and PM Mr. Kirk B. to get a good diagnosis of how to describe what the vault really FEELS like. However, I don't think that it will scare many people away if they've got the guts to even suggest trying it out. If you went from end of the runway to the center of the pit with the most dramatic storyline possible, I know that I would just be like, "Coooool..."

Good luck, and check out the threads that I'm talking about in the 'Coaches' forum.

KirkB wrote:

Split wrote:Ab workouts, usually around 1000 a set, and depending on the day, can go up to 5000.
All this, and we havent even started vaulting yet.

Split, if your reps are true, I'm impressed. In my day, I only worked myself up to a few 100 situp reps per day - max (I don't remember the exact number)! They weren't my actual workout. They were more of a "cool-down", once I was so tuckered out from the rest of my workout that my legs and arms were dead tired - so I worked on the last part of my body that was still "alive".

I do, however, challenge both the accuracy of your counting, and the wisdom of doing so many reps per day. If it's not situps, then reps of what? The reason I ask is because you need to divide your workout time into areas of strength, speed, coordination (gymnastics), conditioning, and endurance. I used situps as a strength, conditioning, and an endurance drill (by doing them last, before I hit the showers). It sounds like you might be using them for a major part of your workout, which takes time and energy away from all of the other areas that vaulters also need to work on. How many miles per week are you running whilst you're doing all these ab reps?

Regarding your thread title, I'm a little puzzled. Are you truly wanting to ENCOURAGE "ambitious" beginners whilst DISCOURAGING lazy people? If so, then there's no need to scare them away with words. Words are just words. Lazy athletes will weed themselves out by Darwin's theory of natural selection - Survival of the Fittest!

I hope you're not a coach - you have a very immature attitude. I mean that in an honest, constructive way, so take it to heart. Rather than boasting about your hard workouts, why don't you encourage as many kids as you possibly can to join the sport? Don't tell them how tough it is - tell them how much fun it is! You might find a few "diamonds in the rough". You might even find some kids that are initially lazy, but come to love the sport, and get over their laziness.

I've heard of baseball teams and soccer teams having to make early cuts, due to too many players. But I've never heard of a new vaulter getting cut from workouts. You can't really tell from the first practice who will stick with it and who won't. The more the merrier. Kids will weed themselves out - you don't have to.

I see no need to "intimidate the lazy ones with describing how hard it is".

Oh yes - I almost forgot ...

So you did this "heavy workout" for only ONE WEEK, and then you were ready to vault? Exactly what week of this year was this week? I wonder what you did the WEEK BEFORE that week? If I did HALF those workouts for only ONE WEEK, I'd be so dog-tired and aching that I'd barely be able to pull the pole out of the bag! There's a lot of bravado in your claims, but I would be interested to hear what your workouts REALLY consisted of - and for how long before you picked up a pole - THIS YEAR!

Kirk

I divide the workouts into 10 exercises of 100.
It's basically crunches, bicycles, toe touchers, guillotins (sp?), leg lifts, scubba legs (thats what we call them), situps with weights, V-Shape Situps from side to side, (left, right, left = 1) side situps (both ways), and supermans(i think they are called back hypers).
Each rep is done at moderate intensity, focusing more on technique than reps. However, this part of the workout can last for up to half an hour, as I make sure that I do make the 1000 reps. Depending on how much time I have left, I continue to do them until I finish my half hour.
The first week is sort of a "hell week" to weed out the lazy vaulters. Last year we had several vaulters on the VARSITY level that were to lazy to do any work whatsoever and no heighted at every meet. With only 2 vaulters, including myself, returning next year, we need to make sure that we don't waste our time on the lazy people who just vault to avoid running.
The entire month before is spent doing short sprint workouts, (max distance 150) plyometrics, and weights.

The kids won't be cut from workouts, they will be encouraged to leave at any time they find it too dificult.
I've been lifting for quite some time, so the lifting workouts do not bother me whatsoever, and as you noticed, there were 5 different workouts, for five different days of the week.

The entire month before is spent doing short sprint workouts, (max distance 150) plyometrics, and weights.

And pole runs. And plant drills. And sand vaulting. And plenty of high bar. And some time on the pit with the focus on the swing. I can't wait until you get BTB2! There are a few chapters just for you!

Well this was my first year, so during the first month, the vault coach didn't come, so we didn't have access to any of the pole vault stuff. The pit wasn't set up, the pole shed was locked up. Now, the track head coach took over, so there will be more access to them, plus, a graduating vaulter is going to try and come help us when season starts.

Yeah, I've been wanting to ask, but it's such a stupid question.
How do I order BTB2?

You can buy BTB2 here: http://polevaultpower.com/store/ I bought it a month ago, and it's a great source of PV coaching/training info. Everyone on this forum should have a copy.

There's other places to buy it, but buying it from PVP supports the cost of Becca supporting this PV forum.

Split, I like your moniker! May I ask where you got it from?

But I still don't get this:

... we need to make sure that we don't waste our time on the lazy people who just vault to avoid running ...

Is Track & Field mandatory at your school? Aren't the REALLY LAZY ones the ones that just don't show up for ANY event?

Note to powerplant42: Don't volunteer me to PM - volunteer yourself. See - I'm back to disagreeing with you!

Kirk

KirkB wrote:Split, I like your moniker! May I ask where you got it from?

Hey, what about me? I lived almost all my life in Split, Croatia
http://www.split.hr/povijest_ENG.htm

KirkB wrote:You can buy BTB2 here: http://polevaultpower.com/store/ I bought it a month ago, and it's a great source of PV coaching/training info. Everyone on this forum should have a copy.

There's other places to buy it, but buying it from PVP supports the cost of Becca supporting this PV forum.

Split, I like your moniker! May I ask where you got it from?

But I still don't get this:

... we need to make sure that we don't waste our time on the lazy people who just vault to avoid running ...

Is Track & Field mandatory at your school? Aren't the REALLY LAZY ones the ones that just don't show up for ANY event?

Note to powerplant42: Don't volunteer me to PM - volunteer yourself. See - I'm back to disagreeing with you!

Kirk

Some people join track to either throw or vault, and get an easy A.
However, my coach just told me that we will be having track tryouts starting December, to avoid this, and having a big team.
Moniker? My screen name?
I guess its a lot of things...like, all it takes is a split second to change a life, for good or bad, and also because I run like a 11.3 split in the 100 meters, but a 12.3 off of blocks. Now I guess its part of your steps to a good vault!

Also, if I'm sending a check, how long will it take for the check to get to seattle if I send it tomorrow?
I live in SoCal.

Note to powerplant42: Don't volunteer me to PM - volunteer yourself. See - I'm back to disagreeing with you!

Ah, yes, I should... however, I'm not anywhere near as familiar with describing the 'feel' of the vault as you are... I would not be as good of a resource! I'm sure we'll find something that we can agree on sometime soon.

If your vaulters are Jr. high to high school age, being a pole vaulter or "giving it a try" should NEVER be presented the way basic training is presented to a new Army recruit. As has already been mentioned, you really must get Beginner to Bubka and utilize it in your coaching approach. Keep in mind you're a coach not a drill sergeant. Those days of coaching went out the window back in the early 70's. I volunteer coached at a high school in 2007. We had some nice beginners that this past year improved quite a bit. What I did was put together an off season training guide for them with the following forward. The last paragraph pretty much sums up what they themselves had to "commit" to to progress in this event . The forward also allows for those that don't commit all the way with the open invitation to still be on the team. If you are coaching in a high school setting, key thing to remember is that it is their team not yours. Here's the forward. Hopefully you can get some insight to what it presents. The traing Guide was given to my vaulters at the end of the season banquet.
Forward

What a great year 2007 was for the Mustang Lady Vaulters! All returning vaulters improved their 2006 personal bests and we had some really breakout performances. Now is when next year begins. What I’ve put together is an off season guide for you to work with so you are ready for the 2008 track season.
Pole vaulting is an event that can’t be mastered (or become competitive in), in just the short time we have from March to the end of May. If you want to be a state class vaulter you will need to commit to “committing to the event”. What that means is, but not limited to is; finding a vault camp to attend this summer, join and participate in a vault club, research the event via www.polevaultpower.com and other pole vault websites, do the training and drills provided in this book, join USATF and compete in USATF all comer meets, in other words, GET HOOKED ON POLE VAULTING!
Coach and I are so pumped about yours, and the whole team’s future potential, but we need a concerted effort from you between now and next March to have you achieve the results that we know you can deliver. Put in the effort and the Moundsview Mustang Lady vaulters will establish Moundsview High School as 2008’s “POLE VAULT HIGH”.
This book will include a testimonial by my mentor Doug “Bubba” Sparks as to what it means to really be hooked on this event and make a commitment to it. I’ll also include a weight and running guide for you to follow to get you ready for next year. You’ll also find a list of website addresses that will help you get the info you’ll need to do the things I asked of you in the above.
At this point it’s time to ask the question of you that my friend Bubba asks all of his vaulters, “are you curious or are you serious”? Whatever the answer, you are still a part of the Mustang Lady Vaulters and we’re glad you’re on our team. If you want to be one of our top producers, you need to ask yourself “am I willing to put in the effort”? It’s our hope that you will. I’ll know which it is by; A) Whether or not you still have this book next March when the team starts practice, and B) how tattered and torn it is from use when we start practice next March. So, it’s up to you…….................

WILL YOU BE READY?
Coach Mike Soule