Atkins Attack Vault Technique

[rainbowgirl28]

Let me clarify a few things here.

Coach Atkins has made his coaching philosophy or whatever public information on his website.

I would not normally allow such a heated thread debating another coach's technique, but he makes a lot of big claims on there, and I think you all have a right to debate them.

You may not agree with the way he coaches, but remember that he has provided opportunities to vault for countless kids who would not get to touch a pole otherwise. Different things work for different people, clearly at least SOME people have improved under him.

I have never heard anyone else claim to have IMPROVED Petrov's technique. I have heard many people claim to use it, and that is debateable how close they are.

[altius]

We seem to have several agendas running in parallel here and I only want to address one, because it is an important issue for vaulters everywhere. Is the 'Atkins attack' superior to Petrov's approach or not. If Saraf's vault shown in the clips above is an indication of the former approach I do not believe it is better - and indeed may be handicapping the athlete.

Saraf - for a young vaulter you do a LOT of things well. I especially like your second phase as you drive your chest up through the shoulders and get a long whip swing around your hands. Because you are efficient there you do a pretty good job of staying long to cover the pole instead of tucking underneath it like 90% of vaulters. You then get a bit untidy but that is not unexpected for your age and experience.

However the problems start with the first step and go on to affect your take off - which if anything is a bit flat. You lean forward throughout your run -the guys who just came back from formia can tell you all about that but in essence Petrov wants the hips up and forward as you run, not down and behind your shoulders. The pole carry is loose and three steps out the left hand is about 60cms behind your left hip -with the right hand low and close to the right hip - both not recommended by Petrov nor efficient pole vaulting. Because now you have to move both hands a long way to get them into position for take off and it looks to me as though the left arm does not make it into a fully extended strong position before you leave the ground - not good. The combination of the forward lean in the run -wide grip and unfinished left arm punch are probably why you do take off a bit flat. This may prevent you moving your grip up in the future.

The run and plant are the important issues because that is where the claimed improvements have been made - what I see is definitely not an improvement on Petrovs ideas.

You look like a very athletic guy who has good speed and body awareness. In my opinion - for what it is worth - arguing as I am for the tried and true Petrov model - you would be a better vaulter if you considered these issues. That said, somebody has taught you some good things - things that the guys looking at the take off in another post might learn something from.

[bjvando]

We seem to have several agendas running in parallel here and I only want to address one, because it is an important issue for vaulters everywhere. Is the 'Atkins attack' superior to Petrov's approach or not. If Saraf's vault shown in the clips above is an indication of the former approach I do not believe it is better - and indeed may be handicapping the athlete.

Couldn't agree more to this- Becca was right too. We strayed away from the original debate. Is his system an improvement on Petrovs?

I believe that the high majority of us on pvp will agree that it is not a 'new and improved petrov model'.

What do the Atkins supporters think on that single particular claim? Philanthropy and state titles aside...

[SlickVT]

Consider me finished with this topic. I have said what I need to say, and frankly I am tired of the whole thing.

Petrov is a fantastic coach, but if someone commits pole vault blasphemy and says that they think it could get better (and believe it or not, this doesnt mean you are going to spend eternity in hell), then all the power to them.

Exploring new and different technique is what got us to where we are today, and I credit Lance for changing things up and trying new things throughout our time working together, and Adam can also back this up- it makes you a better vaulter because you are more willing and able to change things about your vault.

Don't shun people for thinking outside the box a little bit. History has, over and over, proven that that is a bad idea.

I'm done.

[rainbowgirl28]

What do the Atkins supporters think on that single particular claim? Philanthropy and state titles aside...

I have had several people tell me that this is not a claim he makes in person at his camps.

Perhaps he got a little carried away with the hyperbole on the website.

[vaultmd]

Okay, so neither saraf nor Slickvt have actually articulated what the so-called "Atkins Attack" is, whether it really exists, the differences from the Petrov model or why it is an improvement.

We'll have to depend on the starter of the thread, PV ers Dad, enlighten us when he figures it out . . .

[Bonevt]

I think that this is a very tricky subject to talk about, in this sport every other coach you talk to has different technique. This is even apparent with extremely well known coaches.

Over my pole vaulting career I have worked with lance in my earlier years as well as other well respected coaches. Personally, I picked up many bad habits with lance, as well as various athletes. All of these vaulters jumped with lance for a extended period of time. Also I think that to examine how good a coach is, their star athletes shouldn't be the only ones looked at . Many vaulters are foremost great athletes and that is what allows them to jump high. A good coach will year after year produce good jump.

As for his claims of "coaching" lots of great athletes, it is something that is different for every situation. Lance has the big problem that his facilities are in east bumble. Not many people live with in a sain drivable distance. Almost vaulter that i know moves around from coach to coach, for all different reasons. Its hard to make it once or twice a week to a place more than 1 hour away. That was the reason why I looked elsewhere for coaching.

One last thing that think about is when many of people posting on this topic when to lances there was not where else to go. As apposed to now where there are 2 clubs in Jersey, 2 in eastern PA and at least 1 in NY that is in the general vicinity. Only time will tell what will happen.

[powellpv]

i went to lance a couple times last summer... hes the best! <3 ya lance!

[2-15-46]

when it produces a 21 foot jump...then let's talk!!!