Altius or anyone else who can help

[sghetti]

Pole vaulting season is right around the corner. I've been lifting and doing as much as I can to build a solid base for the upcoming season. I feel like I'm doing everything I can, but I know my method of training is not an optimal one. That's where you guys come in, hopefully.

Second day of training: Towel Runs
http://media.putfile.com/towelrun1
http://media.putfile.com/towelrun2
http://media.putfile.com/towelrun3

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I have a very flat run, I take off under, at a certain point my left hand drops to my hips in every video, my last three steps do not claw the ground and are not quick, my speed with a pole is significantly lower than without one, I do not PLANT-TWO-THREE, and this might or might not be a problem, but I don't really get off the ground at take off.

Solutions?:
20/20 drills
"Jumping into a BIG sandpit"
Picture mentally lowering the pole (I've done this hundreds of times but I still can't keep my left hand under the pole)


Here is what I plan to do once I clear the school's long jump pit:

"You do take off drills in two parts. The first set are done with an emphasis on FINISHING THE TAKE OFF with a complete extension of the take off leg and ANKLE -foot should be pointing down or even slightly back - not towards the pad or box - Yes do you push your grip up until you do JUST get onto the pad. You do almost stall - but not quite!! In this first phase you must learn to stay behind the pole /and the chord of a flexing pole with your hips!

Every athlete in the book is shown finishing the take off - BUT you cannot do this if you take off under - you must begin to learn to take off out! And you can learn that best by jumping into a - BIG -sandpit.

The higher you can grip and just get through on a stiff pole from 6 steps is an indication of your take off efficiency. You should measure it! it is as important as your 100 speed -more important!!! You do the drill off 2/4/6 steps - about six each time. When you have started to get the take off nailed - you bring your grip down a bit - off six steps - and AFTER FINISHING the take off - you try to WHIP your leg through to land on your back on the pad - this can be done with a stiff pole but is better done with a pole which will flex a bit.

it can also be done in a sand pit but instead of landing on your back!!!! you swing your hips up, turn and land facing back the way you came. I did not describe this drill in BTB but did put it on the DVD. Hope this helps. Al"

[sghetti]

I have a question. When you plant and jump, do you flex your lower back to keep your hips as far back as possible? Or do you kind of release your hips so you can punch your right knee up better?

This is what I mean:
http://media.putfile.com/dustinrun

Last season his plant was a hell of a lot better than mine. Even though he's a huge dork I still pay attention to what he does. So do you punch the right knee up like that to keep that seperation or is my technique better?

[Barto]

I love your dedicated approach, but you are making things more complicated than they need to be.

Your difficulty with towel runs is a two part problem.
1) Posture - you are running sideways down the runway. Attempt to keep you chest square to the box as much as possible. This is caused by:

2) Carry - you are supporting the weight of the pole on your bottom hand. This makes it very difficult (read impossible) to get your tip down and still jump off the ground. The bottom hand only steers the pole as it drops. The weight of the pole must be supported in the top hand. Otherwise you will reach with the takeoff stride in order to gain balance and stability. This is why most people are under - poor carry technique.

Can you shoot a layup? When you do is your step under? Your step will always be on when shooting layups because you take the weight of the ball straight up over your takeoff foot. If you carry the weight of the pole in our bottom hand then the weight will pull you forward and cause you to reach with your last stride to regain balance. If you carry the pole in the top hand then you can drop the pole to horizontal without being pulled forward. This allows you to jump off the ground without reaching.

[altius]

Agree with barto -you are trying hard. I always have trouble getting decent video pictures with my Mac-especially with the Putfile system so this is a bit of a guess/

1.In the end your actual take off is good with a solid body - but i think your hands are one hand grip too far apart -this makes it difficult to get the vertical emphasis you should be aiming for with this drill.
2. You are running 'behind yourself' not in 'front in front' of yourself - you need to include straight leg claws and ostrich runs in your training to get an active strike with a strong leg hitting the ground- if you take a look at the film you will see that your legs are quite bent when they are in contact with the ground - note especially third step (left) from take off -you are always sitting down -i call that 'running like a duck!! You must run 'Tall' throughout. So when you do do 20/20s you must really emphasise the upward punch of the knee thigh on each stride.
3. When you begin the plant three steps out you are actually dropping the left hand so the pole is parallel with the ground -a no no. From your initial high carry you lower the tip of the pole not by letting the left hand go down but by keeping it high and using it as a fulcrum for the pole to rotate around as the right hand rolls up the right side to the shoulder and then presses up above the head. This will only be resolved by the sort of repetitive drills i have outlined in another post this week. Since this plant practice can be done anytime - even with a stubby -to get the movements of the hands right - you have no reason not to make it perfect!! And i am sure you will try because at the moment you are working against yourself.

Hope this helps. AL
By the way I am going to sue you for plagiarism!

[vault3rb0y]

Im not altius or barto, but ill throw in my part.
I get the feeling there is not a lot of accelleration in your run, your speed after 2 or 3 steps is your speed throughout the run. For a 4 lefts approach, there is no jogging involved, and you should focus on speeding up as quick as you can, throw the runway back, especially on your last step. Great analogy on the lay up in basketball, as for your bottom hand coming to your hip before your take off....
It seems you may be trying to aim the pole into the box, when you should really think about aiming your hands to the sky. Let your bottom hand come to a point about to your chest, and any other pole drop from there should come from the raising of your top hand up the side of your body. You dont want to over-think a pole drop too much, just remember you want your hands up early and over your head before take off. When i do a take off drill the tip of the pole hits the ground on my second-to-last step.
A few other things to keep in mind:

Your drive knee should include a dorso-flexed (pulled toward you) ankle, and try to keep your drive-foot out in front of you a little more (i believe ideally your drive knee is a 90 degree angle, correct me on that).

Your last steps should be quicker than any others in your run, ending with a strong take off... in which your take off leg comes behind you after you take off. Think about throwing the runway back.

I have a question. When you plant and jump, do you flex your lower back to keep your hips as far back as possible? Or do you kind of release your hips so you can punch your right knee up better?

I was taught that flexing your lower back will kill a lot of your upward momentum from the take off, and keep your hands too far in front of you when they should be above your head. Are you worried about your hips getting sucked under? Rather than bending your back, think about keeping a rigid, long back, and push up with both hands to keep your hips from getting sucked under. If you take off hard and strong, with enough momentum upwards, you shouldnt get sucked under.

[sghetti]

Thanks for all the help. I promise to do the drills and keep you guys updated.

There is one problem. Figure 11.14 in BTB shows how to carry the pole. Is the diagram anatomically incorrect? If I hold the pole with my right hand like the diagram, I can't reach the pole with my pinky finger without my wrist being in an awkward position, if that makes sense.

http://media.putfile.com/uncomfortablehold

What I do is hold it with my index and thumb, twist, then hold with my whole hand before I take off.

http://media.putfile.com/holdingthepole

I'm sorry but I've honestly spent hours trying to hold it like the drawing.

[lonestar]

Thanks for all the help. I promise to do the drills and keep you guys updated.

There is one problem. Figure 11.14 in BTB shows how to carry the pole. Is the diagram anatomically incorrect? If I hold the pole with my right hand like the diagram, I can't reach the pole with my pinky finger without my wrist being in an awkward position, if that makes sense.

http://media.putfile.com/uncomfortablehold

What I do is hold it with my index and thumb, twist, then hold with my whole hand before I take off.

http://media.putfile.com/holdingthepole

I'm sorry but I've honestly spent hours trying to hold it like the drawing.

That's not uncommon for your right wrist to feel very uncomfortable holding the pole tight with all your fingers. I feel it is partially flexibility, and that you need to stretch your wrists to help overcome it.

The other part is the position of your left(bottom) hand. You have it out in front of your belly button. Ideally, in a near-vertical pole carry, that left hand should be near the top center of your chest, just right of center of your sternum in front of your right pectoral muscle. That will tuck your left elbow more underneath the left wrist and take stress off of the right wrist. You don't need a death grip on that right hand, but you should be able to close all your fingers on the right. Many elites only wrap 2-3 fingers around the pole with the left hand in this style pole carry.

[sghetti]

http://www.stabhoch.com/movies/20000922 ... rng_lr.mov

http://www.stabhoch.com/movies/20060708 ... va_476.mov

I don't know how to word this without sounding ignorant because I've spent these last few hours trying this out with a broomstick.

I see Bubka holding it like the diagram. Isinbajeva holds it differently. Is it okay for me to hold it like Isinbajeva?

[altius]

Best model is Isinbyeva because you see whole run and plant - with Bubby you only see last steps and when the film starts his left hand is not where he - or Petrov - would want it to be.

[altius]

Note 11.4 c shows the incorrect postion. 11.,4 a and b show one possible way to hold the pole in that position. Bubby gripped the pole tightly with the right hand and let it rest in the V of the left hand, other vaulters let the pole sit in the upside down V of the Right hand and grip with the left while yet others grip with both hands. Flexibility is part of it along with what feels comfortable (and the model for those drawings was a girl -nuf said) - but Lonestar is right. if you get the left hand correctly positioned under the pole at the start of the run - and then keep that hand high throughout you will not go far wrong. Remember that every vault Bubby took was slightly different and even he did not always do what he wanted to do -or should have done!

[vault3rb0y]

Also realize that different pole grips are all just setting you up for a few things:
1.) Running at top speed down the run way
2.) allowing for most powerful take off
3.) allowing for whole body in the right position at take off (ex. hands above head, forceful take off causing a split C)

There may be a few more, but those are what come to mind immediately.

Ive seen several different grips and styles that accomplish the same goal.
I know a high school vaulter with a dead grip on top and bottom hands who vaults 17+. Then i know a high school vaulter who doesnt even wrap his top hand (hand at hip) around the pole until he starts bringing it up his body.

Obviously, listen to what coaches like altius want you to do to grip the pole and for the pole drop, because they are making your run and jump as fast and efficient as possible. Just keep in mind the reasons they are having you do certain things, and you may be able to answer a lot of your own questions.

[sghetti]

Thanks guys. I felt kind of stupid asking a question like that, but yeah I see what you guys are saying now.

I have my first pole vault session tomorrow with Coach Curran at Santa Monica High. I'm getting there 30 minutes before my session to use the huge sand pit next to the runway :]