quick question

[LHSvaulter]

Can somebody please explain to me the difference (if any) between a free take off and a pre-jump?

[altius]

You have opened a can of worms with that question. However since I coined the phase Pre jump in 1989 I suggest that folk take a look at pages 240 thru 245 in "From Beginner to Bubka and Isinbayeva too", before they leap in to answer it.

[mjb]

Since I don't own this book I will give my interpretation of these two, please correct me if I am wrong. Prejump: Take off the ground before the pole hits the back of the box, so you are in the air before the pole even makes contact with the back of the box(DIMA the only person to do consistantly), and Free takeoff: is when your taking off the ground, so your foot is plantar flexed just about to leave the ground and then the pole begins to bend.

[vault3rb0y]

I dont have the book either. But as i understand, you need certain physical capabilities to benefit from a pre-jump. This is why.

While a free take off allows the pole to "touch" the back of the box the instant your toe leaves the ground, a pre-jump leaves you in the air for a certain short length of time before the pole hits the back. During this time in the air, you can be traveling at a high angle toward the bar. So, when the pole tip DOES hit the back of the box, two new things have happened:
1.) your trail leg has more time to come behind you before you swing, because in order to add as much energy to the pole as quickly as possible, you (technically) must swing as soon as the pole tip hits the back.
2.) You are now literally taller at the plant when the pole hits the back. Since you are probably 3 inches above the ground when the pole hits the back, it is like taking off "free" but 3 inches taller.


*Note: This information should not be used by beginner vaulters in attempts to critique themselves.

[LHSvaulter]

i purchased the book the other day and I can't wait for it to come in. Is one more beneficial than the other? It sounds to me like a pre-jump is a better thing to accomplish

[vault3rb0y]

A pre-jump is what bubka referred to when he said he only accomplished it a few times in his career. You can do it, BUT the only way it will help your vault is if you are jumping at an angle of, i would say, at least 30 degrees to the ground? I think it would be better to work on a free take off until you are vaulting around 18' feet or have amazing athletic capabilities, and work on a pre-jump soon after that. If you truly have a free take off, hypothetically every time you leave the ground 3 inches out, you are hitting a pre-jump mark. If you have a free take off and try to get a pre-jump, but cant jump off the ground, all the angular momentum you have will be gone by the time the pole hits the back of the box, and it seems to me that you would pretty much sink into the box and have the opposite effect you are looking for.

Basically, a pre-jump compared with a free take-off seems insane. You might have to jump at a really high angle to get ANY benefit from it, and anyone vaulting under 18' will get more benefit working on OTHER parts of the vault before working on the transition from a free take off to a prejump. Thats just how i see it right now, but im sure BTB can explain it way better than me.

[powerplant42]

Altius talks about drilling for the pre-jump even if one never intends to use it. This is because it helps get down all the things that someone should try to do during take-off (stay behind the pole, arms high, etc.) and it exaggerates the free take-off... Am I right?

[LHSvaulter]

Would the drill demonstrated in the video at the bottom right help me work on these things?

http://www.raisingthebarpv.com/Site/Video.html

[powerplant42]

Wall plants are ok in small doses, just to sort of get a bit of feel for a pole. I definitely wouldn't work with them for technique very much, because it teaches passive phases with the legs and arms.

[altius]

"Would the drill demonstrated in the video at the bottom right help me work on these things?"

I am afraid it will not. But the drill demonstrated by Mitch Fox on pages 118 and 159 of BTB2 and shown in the dvd BTB2 will certainly clarify how to execute the drill. Powerplant 42 is right = -even if you never pre jump in a vault - and it IS very difficult to achieve - the drill will help you improve your take off.

As I indicated previously you can go on discussing this matter until the cows come home - if they still come home that is - but the whole issue is claried in the book and dvd - cant believe that an enthusiast like ou does not have both 3po -still i suppose i should be pleased that you are using the correct phrases, ideas and words. Perhaps i should never have posted anything about this topic on PVP!!!! Then is would still e a complete mystery that you could argue about for years - instead you will find actual quotes for Bubka - eh 3po?? - on the issue.

[altius]

Of course you could come to any on the clinics I will be involved in in the US this summer and you will be taught how to execute the drill - along with a lot of other things that will help improve both your understanding of the vault and your performance.

[powerplant42]

Count me in for the second SRU camp!