"Rowing" Help
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bblinkwme182b
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"Rowing" Help
Anyone have any good ideas for drills to help "row" through a vault? Any help would be awesome. Thanks.
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Don't Row!...Unless you wish to look and jump like the average PV masses out there. That theory is all backwards and brings only bad things to getting in line with your pole. Keep your darn plant hand where it is, drop your shoulders, find the pole and wait!
Heck, technically speaking, the motion people are talking about when they mess you up teaching how to "row"...is not even a row
This is the biggest coaching/learning error out there. Want to keep yourself from going 14, 15, 16 fet as a HS PVr? ...then keep rowing....UPSTREAM (I'd say)
Heck, technically speaking, the motion people are talking about when they mess you up teaching how to "row"...is not even a row
This is the biggest coaching/learning error out there. Want to keep yourself from going 14, 15, 16 fet as a HS PVr? ...then keep rowing....UPSTREAM (I'd say)
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higherflyer
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ADTF Academy
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Well I think the first question should be. DO YOU LOCK OUT THE BOTTOM ARM? Does your current coach beleive in this model or a solid powerful punching plant.
If yes then you need to row. This is one of the fundamental problems in the vault community right now. Many are trying to take two totally different models and combine them. If you have a solid straight bottom arm you must row your hands or the pole will not rotate past inversion and you will land near the box. Yes, I will agree you will never get inverted if you row, but what is worst not getting inverted or landing in the box.
I would take not getting inverted over landing in the box all day. Once again as Dave Neilson put it out at Reno, rotation of the pole must be your number 1 priority. Pole bend and becoming inverted is secondary.
If you have a solid strong bottom arm then you must row or you will have a hard time getting the pole to rotate into the pits. Check out my post on pole rotation to figure out what I mean.
However if you are trying to follow the latest models talked about on this site (being elastic) then you don't want to row so you can stay with the pole cord as you swing to inversion.
To row or not to row will depend on the model you are using. If you have no idea what model you are using then I would start there by learning why you do the things you do and what the coach if you have one wants you to do. Then and only then can this question be answered. Until then to row or not to row is a generic statement that means very little. In fact by taking people's advice on this subject could cause harm if your on to big of a pole. Figure out what you doing first and what you focus is then you can find the answer to the question to row or not to row.
If yes then you need to row. This is one of the fundamental problems in the vault community right now. Many are trying to take two totally different models and combine them. If you have a solid straight bottom arm you must row your hands or the pole will not rotate past inversion and you will land near the box. Yes, I will agree you will never get inverted if you row, but what is worst not getting inverted or landing in the box.
I would take not getting inverted over landing in the box all day. Once again as Dave Neilson put it out at Reno, rotation of the pole must be your number 1 priority. Pole bend and becoming inverted is secondary.
If you have a solid strong bottom arm then you must row or you will have a hard time getting the pole to rotate into the pits. Check out my post on pole rotation to figure out what I mean.
However if you are trying to follow the latest models talked about on this site (being elastic) then you don't want to row so you can stay with the pole cord as you swing to inversion.
To row or not to row will depend on the model you are using. If you have no idea what model you are using then I would start there by learning why you do the things you do and what the coach if you have one wants you to do. Then and only then can this question be answered. Until then to row or not to row is a generic statement that means very little. In fact by taking people's advice on this subject could cause harm if your on to big of a pole. Figure out what you doing first and what you focus is then you can find the answer to the question to row or not to row.
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AVC Coach
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Great post ADTF Academy! I never understood why anyone would want to row, but I guess if you are jamming that bottom arm out, you probably have to row just to have a chance of getting inverted.
If your goal is to go up, and I hope it is, then your goal has to be to make every fiber of your body GO UP!!!! Nothing drops, moves, or rows down until you've made the bar and are headed for the pit.
If your goal is to go up, and I hope it is, then your goal has to be to make every fiber of your body GO UP!!!! Nothing drops, moves, or rows down until you've made the bar and are headed for the pit.
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ADTF Academy
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Rowing won't get you inverted. It will simply get the apex of the bend past vertical enough so the pole rolls over. Big bottom arm doesn't help with rotation only bending the pole. If you don't move the apex you merely get launched backwards. Actually rowing causes you to not be able to get inverted.
THis is why so many are frustrated and confused right now. People are going in eight million directions.
THis is why so many are frustrated and confused right now. People are going in eight million directions.
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vaultwest
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I disagree with your statement or perhaps more correctly stated I think what we have here is a failure to comunicate.
I think Bubka rowed in his vaults or as it has been stated that he continued to put energy into the vault through this phase of the jump.
There is a correct way and an incorrect way to row.
If the vaulter rows his arms as he swings and rotates his C of G (hips) up to the top of pole the the twin goals of keepoing the pole bent until the extension turn happens and getting into the inverted positon will not only occcur but will be performed correctly.
On the other hand if the vaulter only levers and leaves his hips hanging down below his shoulders then yes only a large pole bend will occur and swinging up into the inverted position probably will not happen.
So I think perhaps this is a symantics type of thing but I think we should focus on rowing correctly not whether it is right or not to row.
Just my 2 cents worth
I think Bubka rowed in his vaults or as it has been stated that he continued to put energy into the vault through this phase of the jump.
There is a correct way and an incorrect way to row.
If the vaulter rows his arms as he swings and rotates his C of G (hips) up to the top of pole the the twin goals of keepoing the pole bent until the extension turn happens and getting into the inverted positon will not only occcur but will be performed correctly.
On the other hand if the vaulter only levers and leaves his hips hanging down below his shoulders then yes only a large pole bend will occur and swinging up into the inverted position probably will not happen.
So I think perhaps this is a symantics type of thing but I think we should focus on rowing correctly not whether it is right or not to row.
Just my 2 cents worth
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Vault&Flip
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vaultwest wrote:I disagree with your statement or perhaps more correctly stated I think what we have here is a failure to comunicate.
I think Bubka rowed in his vaults or as it has been stated that he continued to put energy into the vault through this phase of the jump.
There is a correct way and an incorrect way to row.
If the vaulter rows his arms as he swings and rotates his C of G (hips) up to the top of pole the the twin goals of keepoing the pole bent until the extension turn happens and getting into the inverted positon will not only occcur but will be performed correctly.
On the other hand if the vaulter only levers and leaves his hips hanging down below his shoulders then yes only a large pole bend will occur and swinging up into the inverted position probably will not happen.
So I think perhaps this is a symantics type of thing but I think we should focus on rowing correctly not whether it is right or not to row.
Just my 2 cents worth
I agree to a certain extent. I get tired of people whining about the terminology that is used to convey an idea when in a sense, it's just semantics we are arguing about. I've known many good coaches who used completely different terminology to describe the same technical aspects of the vault, and who would probably be denounced for their use of "bad terminology."
its one of those things that no one knows what to do because were im from my coach teaches to row them but that his style... i cant say that not rowing would help because hes had 3 16 footers in 1 year and 8 total and 1 guy that jumped 17......its just coaching styles is what it seems like to me
pain is only temporary victory is forever
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